Is XVID HD worth it?

General discussion relating to XBMC4XBOX. Please use the support forums for help on using the software or plugins.
ocmdiaz714
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:25 pm

Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by ocmdiaz714 » Sun Nov 25, 2012 8:56 pm

I've been encoding bluray rips to a XVID files with a resolution of 960x544. Now, what I want to know is, is such a resolution worth the added GB to say a 720x400 file? Because, I've heard that an avi file, no matter the resolution, will look the same.

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:17 pm

it certainly wont look the same, but depends on screen/connection/bitrate etc. AVI is not actually relevant here. That's just a container for the audio/video data.

I transcode to 1280x720 with ffmpeg's mpeg4 codec in mkv container rather than xvid, as I can control min/max bitrates and with mkv, can copy the subs and audio as is from the source material.

ocmdiaz714
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by ocmdiaz714 » Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:32 pm

BuZz wrote:it certainly wont look the same, but depends on screen/connection/bitrate etc. AVI is not actually relevant here. That's just a container for the audio/video data.

I transcode to 1280x720 with ffmpeg's mpeg4 codec in mkv container rather than xvid, as I can control min/max bitrates and with mkv, can copy the subs and audio as is from the source material.
I'm new to encoding, and I lookup the original bluray rip's bitrate and set that as the bitrate to use on MEGUi. I simply want the best available quality, to make use of my component cables and 32" plasma.

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Sun Nov 25, 2012 9:38 pm

i use (commandline ffmpeg)

Code: Select all

ffmpeg -i some_1080p_infile.mkv -scodec copy -acodec copy -vcodec mpeg4 -b:v 3000k -maxrate 5000k -bufsize 4096k -s 1280x720 -f matroska -y outfile.mkv
single pass (as I transcode in realtime using mediatomb), but results look decent.

ocmdiaz714
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by ocmdiaz714 » Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:37 am

BuZz wrote:i use (commandline ffmpeg)

Code: Select all

ffmpeg -i some_1080p_infile.mkv -scodec copy -acodec copy -vcodec mpeg4 -b:v 3000k -maxrate 5000k -bufsize 4096k -s 1280x720 -f matroska -y outfile.mkv
single pass (as I transcode in realtime using mediatomb), but results look decent.
I'm going to try encoding XVID at a true 720p resolution. I don't know if you're familiar with MEGUI, but you are given the option of selecting the video bitrate, but no control over setting a max. So what I do is go with whatever the bitrate is on the original bluray rip I'm working with.

And I appreciate the code you posted, but I have to go with MEGUI as I don't even know where to start with the code, where to enter it, what to edit, nothing.

Edit: Tried FFMPEG:

Image

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Mon Nov 26, 2012 8:46 am

ocmdiaz714 wrote: I'm going to try encoding XVID at a true 720p resolution. I don't know if you're familiar with MEGUI, but you are given the option of selecting the video bitrate, but no control over setting a max. So what I do is go with whatever the bitrate is on the original bluray rip I'm working with.
that's the reason I am recommending ffmpeg's mpeg4 codec - you can control maximum bitrate, rather than just an overall average. using xvid you may end up scenes where you get dropped frames etc.
ocmdiaz714 wrote: And I appreciate the code you posted, but I have to go with MEGUI as I don't even know where to start with the code, where to enter it, what to edit, nothing.

Edit: Tried FFMPEG:
it would have worked, cept your ffmpeg is ancient. no idea where you found that!

http://www.ffmpeg.org/download.html links to http://ffmpeg.zeranoe.com/builds/ for windows builds

ocmdiaz714
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by ocmdiaz714 » Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:46 pm

BuZz wrote:
ocmdiaz714 wrote: I'm going to try encoding XVID at a true 720p resolution. I don't know if you're familiar with MEGUI, but you are given the option of selecting the video bitrate, but no control over setting a max. So what I do is go with whatever the bitrate is on the original bluray rip I'm working with.
that's the reason I am recommending ffmpeg's mpeg4 codec - you can control maximum bitrate, rather than just an overall average. using xvid you may end up scenes where you get dropped frames etc.
ocmdiaz714 wrote: And I appreciate the code you posted, but I have to go with MEGUI as I don't even know where to start with the code, where to enter it, what to edit, nothing.

Edit: Tried FFMPEG:
it would have worked, cept your ffmpeg is ancient. no idea where you found that!

http://www.ffmpeg.org/download.html links to http://ffmpeg.zeranoe.com/builds/ for windows builds
Ok I went ahead and downloaded the lasted static build, and everything seems to be working fine. Mind telling me the code to run a 2pass encode?

I'm in the process of encoding a movie. What's the audio codec and bitrate going to be? I guess 448kbps AC3 would be the best choice for a 720p file? I was using 640kbps for my 960x544 encodes.

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Mon Nov 26, 2012 7:59 pm

the commandline copies the audio from source. as I use this to transcode from hd rips etc, I don't want to re-encode the audio, as I pipe it though my surround system.

you will need to look up / search about 2 pass encodes. maybe thats only xvid anyway. unsure about ffmpegs mpeg4 codec.

User avatar
spicemuseum
Posts: 906
Joined: Mon Jul 09, 2012 11:08 pm
Has thanked: 94 times
Been thanked: 75 times

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by spicemuseum » Mon Nov 26, 2012 9:05 pm

BuZz wrote:
ocmdiaz714 wrote: I'm going to try encoding XVID at a true 720p resolution. I don't know if you're familiar with MEGUI, but you are given the option of selecting the video bitrate, but no control over setting a max. So what I do is go with whatever the bitrate is on the original bluray rip I'm working with.
that's the reason I am recommending ffmpeg's mpeg4 codec - you can control maximum bitrate, rather than just an overall average. using xvid you may end up scenes where you get dropped frames etc.
Agree.
Just for reference, XVID and ffmepg's "mpeg4" are both example implementations of the official standard MPEG4 (Pt2) Advanced Simple Profile (ASP), or H.263 *, coding scheme - DIVX is yet another example. Each has strengths and weaknesses, but all (largely) conform to the standard.

* yes, a simplification, but this subject can get immensely complicted, if you want it to. For example H.264 is actually MPEG4 (Pt10) Advanced Video Coding (AVC), with x264 being an example implementation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MPEG-4#MPEG-4_Parts


Oh, and yes, BTW, progressive rips of 1280x720 (or less) i.e. "720p", are definitely worth it, even in xvid (H.263, MPEG4 (pt2) ASP) :-).

ocmdiaz714
Posts: 21
Joined: Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:25 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by ocmdiaz714 » Tue Nov 27, 2012 7:32 pm

Ok I went and I tried BuZz's method as well as a 2 pass XVID encode. No significant change in file size or, in my opinion, quality. Although the 1 pass encode was delivered about a good 8 hours sooner than the 2 pass.

Image

Image

Screenshots suck. I know.
..the FFmpeg encode does look sharper, is smaller in size, and 1 pass seems to work fine and sheds off a great amount of time I'm used to spending with 2 pass XVID encodes. I just find it annoying having to extract the audio to convert it to AC3, and manually calculating to re-size to mod16. And, is there any advantage to 2 pass? If so, can somebody please give me a command line to use? And maybe tell me if it's possible to have FFmpeg also encode the audio.

I also do hope to one day upgrade to maybe an Apple TV or WD TV Live, and want to go with the format that's best compatible, and basically future-proof with home media devices, and obviously in HD.

oeneprs
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2012 6:46 am

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by oeneprs » Thu Dec 20, 2012 3:03 pm

wait, so you guys can play hd video (720p) on your original xbox using xbmc?

Geeba
Posts: 531
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 11:32 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 59 times
Been thanked: 30 times

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by Geeba » Thu Dec 20, 2012 5:21 pm

oeneprs wrote:wait, so you guys can play hd video (720p) on your original xbox using xbmc?
Yeah! looks good too.... :)

User avatar
2 Bunny
Posts: 99
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:55 pm
Location: United States
Has thanked: 13 times
Been thanked: 3 times
Contact:

DIVX Reply

Post by 2 Bunny » Mon Dec 31, 2012 5:23 pm

BuZz wrote:i use (commandline ffmpeg)

Code: Select all

ffmpeg -i some_1080p_infile.mkv -scodec copy -acodec copy -vcodec mpeg4 -b:v 3000k -maxrate 5000k -bufsize 4096k -s 1280x720 -f matroska -y outfile.mkv
single pass (as I transcode in realtime using mediatomb), but results look decent.
Thanks a ton for that. I've been looking everywhere basically forever to find a way to convert HD videos to play on the Xbox in 720p with minimal frame drops, and that did it for me. Is there any way to convert more than one video that way in the command prompt?

- 2 Bunny
Now part of the All New Channel 2012 Network.
Image

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Tue Jan 01, 2013 1:55 pm

could wrap it in a script to process multiple files etc.

I tend to use it with mediatomb, and transcode on demand.

User avatar
2 Bunny
Posts: 99
Joined: Mon Dec 31, 2012 4:55 pm
Location: United States
Has thanked: 13 times
Been thanked: 3 times
Contact:

HIGH RESOLUTION Reply

Post by 2 Bunny » Tue Jan 01, 2013 5:28 pm

BuZz wrote:could wrap it in a script to process multiple files etc.

I tend to use it with mediatomb, and transcode on demand.
Wow, how does that work? You have files shared by the computer to the Xbox and then when you click on the file in the Xbox, the software converts it on the fly and then it disappears when it's done? The Xbox is fast enough to keep up with streaming the high def over the network? I suppose the computer has no trouble doing this as I was encoding at around 70fps when I did my sample conversion.

- 2B
Now part of the All New Channel 2012 Network.
Image

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: HIGH RESOLUTION Reply

Post by BuZz » Wed Jan 02, 2013 5:26 pm

2 Bunny wrote: Wow, how does that work? You have files shared by the computer to the Xbox and then when you click on the file in the Xbox, the software converts it on the fly and then it disappears when it's done? The Xbox is fast enough to keep up with streaming the high def over the network? I suppose the computer has no trouble doing this as I was encoding at around 70fps when I did my sample conversion.
you have a UPnP share provided by mediatomb. I have a mediatomb config that uses that commandline for any files that are "mkv", so they get transcoded on demand. you lose the ability to fast forward/rewind etc though.

m7cky
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:09 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by m7cky » Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:13 pm

Hi Buzz
Can you scrape your upnp source or do you have to use in files mode?
I tried it once but the paths kept changing so no worky.

Thanks for the continued work btw :-)

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:26 pm

m7cky wrote:Hi Buzz
Can you scrape your upnp source or do you have to use in files mode?
I tried it once but the paths kept changing so no worky.

Thanks for the continued work btw :-)
:) Just in files mode.

m7cky
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:09 pm

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by m7cky » Wed Jan 02, 2013 7:34 pm

Ah that's cool anyway, will set it up later, gotta be better than my current SD & HD for every movie I have :-)
Thanks for quick reply, & apologies to OP for hijack!

User avatar
BuZz
Site Admin
Posts: 1889
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2012 12:50 am
Location: UK
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 421 times
Contact:

Re: Is XVID HD worth it?

Post by BuZz » Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:05 pm

I can post my mediatomb config if useful although you may want to use another upnp server.

Post Reply