Trusty motherboard dying - any ideas to help?

[CapedCrusader]

Hi guys, long time no see:)

I've a problem with my trusty motherboard - when I power it on, it switches on and off three times, then frags.

When the problem started, it was from time to time, with X3 modchip only (with the chip unplugged it booted OK). Moving the chip (wiggling) helped, but only for some boots, then the problem returned.

At the moment, the frag situation persists, no matter if the chip plugged in or not (I can't boot at all).

My idea was faulty RAM chips soldering, I gave the ones at the bottom of the board some reflow (hot air), but no luck. I am planning to try the ones on the top of the mobo.

Any other suggestions?

Thanks a lot for help,
Bart

[professor_jonny]

have you reseated the processor chip?

[CapedCrusader]

No, I haven't touched it. But do you mean reflowing the whole socket or is it possible to normally take the cpu out without any soldering? The first option would require specialised equipment I guess.

[professor_jonny]

no pull the processor chip out and reseat it.
dont go near it with a soldering device!!!
take the heatsink off to expose the lock screw on the socket unlock the socket then pull out the processor push it back in and lock the screw and reassemble it.

im guessing you have a socketed processor if you press down on the corner it can pop out of the socket and frag i have had it happen before.

[CapedCrusader]

Thaks, checked the CPU. Unfortunately, it is fitted well.

Found this:

http://www.xbox-hq.com/html/xbox-tutorials-163.html

1.Green/Red Flashing
Problem: The Xbox will restart twice, and then flash red and green. This is known as the FRAG and can be caused by many reasons. Typically when you receive this error you will not have any video. Possible reasons you may get this is a bad bios image, a bad bios chip, the Nvidia MCPX chip is damaged, broken/damaged traces or solder splashes on the mother board.

Fix: If you were doing any kind of soldering work (adding a Modchip or other type of mod) on or around your motherboard, make sure there are no solder splashes or that there are not solder bridges connecting any traces. If there are, desolder them. If you have not done any kind of modding to the unit, then its likely to be caused from a bad tsop image, or a bad chip. Try installing a Modchip to see if you can get the unit to boot. If the Xbox still gives a FRAG then it means another major component is bad and the motherboard needs to be replaced.

Now I'm goin to try to clean the LPC off solder and check the traces.

If you have some other ideas, they are welcomed

[Geeba]

I'd be tempted to drop Trusty a quick email..... he always seemed pretty helpful. maybe ask him to join up here!

[CapedCrusader]

Thanks Geeba, I'll think about it. It could be difficult to help remotely though.

For now I'm giving up. I've checked lpc traces continuity (1.0 board):

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y18/ch ... _guide.jpg

and everything is fine.

There can be countless reasons for the frag, after many hours of inspection I could maybe fix it (or maybe not), but it is probably not woth the time spent.

[CapedCrusader]

There is one advantage to all this - the broken trusty pushed me to apply 128 mb mod to another board, which I successfully accomplished last night

However, it does not work as smoothly as with the 1.4 Ghz cpu, but better that than the stock box, especially now when XBMC uses the full 128 mb.

[Xphazer]

What about the PSU? Last time one of 128MB Xbox started to FRAG out of noware, it was the PSU.

[CapedCrusader]

The PSU is ok - works well with another board.

[r32crazy01]

What modifications does Trusty do to the motherboard to run the 1.4ghz CPU with the adapter other than fit a socket? I saw a small wire under the motherboard around the CPU area between two traces, but other than that I couldn't spot anything obvious.

My Trusty powered Xbox seems to power off by itself sometimes, tried different psu's as well without any success. I talked a local place with a BGA rework station and they can remove the CPU and fit a socket for a good price to the Xbox motherboard. Tempted to purchase one of these and give it a try http://www.os-store.com/oem-socket-495p ... ron-m.html.

[professor_jonny]

under the processor socket it has some of the solder balls is specific places removed i think to do with the jtag points on the processor.

the problem is making a socket adaptor to fit a desktop cpu in the mobile socket or you are limited to a mobile cpu and they dont come in 1.4 gig flavours.

if it is powering off is it flashing orange when it does or like you are pressing the power button it could be corosion dammage it hapens and causes symptoms like that.

[r32crazy01]

I was thought that might be the case that some solder balls are missing, the place I'm talking to has XRay for BGA as well. So can confirm what solder balls are missing on my current board Trusty fitted the socket to.

I am aware that the adapter is needed that's almost imposable to make, but I already have my one from Trusty. I was possibly planning to use it on another board without the turning off issue.

No flashes from overheating, just random dies like I pressed the power button. I've had one or two stock xbox's do this to me in the past as well. Probably have a look for corrosion when I get a chance.

[CapedCrusader]

So, r32crazy01, you have given me the idea - I guess I can move the 1.4 cpu from the Trusty board to another 1.0 board, on which I have done the 128 mb mod!

Now, this is what it looks like:

1) Heatsink mounted (unscrewed):



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

2) Heatsink removed - top of the cpu unit:



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

3) The cpu unit removed next to the cpu socket:



Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

3) The cpu unit itself (it is fixed together, no possibility to disassemble):



Uploaded with ImageShack.us



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

[CapedCrusader]

Please give me a hint on what I should do.

My idea is to take it to a workshop which has a rework station, desolder the socket from the faulty board and replace the cpu on the good board with the socket.

A few questions:

1) If I understood correctly from the previous post, such a socket is unavailable, therefore it will have to be desoldered form the Trusty board, correct?
2) Is there any possibility to check the cpu to establish whether it is working or not before the whole operation?
3) As I read, I will have to tell them to check which soldering point below the socket must be left empty, right?

Thanks a lot for help!

[professor_jonny]

you can get a socket from an old mobile p3 laptop but you need a reball template if you dont get a new socket.

it might be harder finding a reball template than a socket.
you can plug the trusty cpu into an old p3 based laptop as long as it is a mobile one and not a desktop cpu but wheather it will work or not you will have to ask trusty.

there are solder balls missingunder the socket and modifications on the underside of the motherboard to the cpu bus mutlipier (i think).

send it to trusty to check and he can supply a new board or processor if nesessary, the processors are quite robust it would more likely be the motherboard. of note the socket can be dammaged by pressing the cpu in while it is still locked.

[Geeba]

I've worked in PC building/support in the past for many years.... I've never had a CPU fail in all honesty... usually always the board...

I'd get Trusty on the case...

Does it stay on long enough to boot anything? if it does maybe load Linux on it and try some diagnostic software? just a thought....

[CapedCrusader]

Thanks guys!

I'm not thinking of involving Trusty so far, as shipping costs from Poland to China and back must substantial. I'll leave it as the last resort.

So, to put it simple - if I bring the two boards to a reapir workshop, will they be able to do this job or is it too complicated?

@Geeba

The board doesn't boot at all, it switches on and off 2 times and then switches on and frags.

[Xphazer]

If you succeed, you will be the 3rd known person /group in the world to have done it.
The Friendtech guys and Trusty are the only known person to have done it AFAIK.

[Geeba]

Yep not an easy job..... pretty sure there are modifications done to the board as well.... the PIII Tualatin 1.4Ghz was awkward thing to get working PC's.... on an xbox board is sheer genius level.